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WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Tue Apr 07, 2020 11:31 am
by PG
Join us in this upcoming WaveLab Google Hangout, in which Justin Perkins is going to show us his workflows. You will also have the opportunity to ask questions and get them answer in real time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7yH8-ZF ... e=youtu.be

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Tue Apr 07, 2020 1:05 pm
by Justin P
Yes. This is not a mastering tutorial but instead, an example of how I use WaveLab Pro to get things done. It's amazing how many new users don't even know about the Audio Montage, or that you can use Clip FX for example.

I'll also link to my basic metadata presets for the montage, and other settings and presets that can help users get things done accurately and quickly, without frustration and confusion.

Over the years, I have a good idea of the recurring usual questions from new and intermediate users, but even long time users might gain some insight on ways they can improve their workflow and usage of WaveLab Pro.

This first one will just cover the basics and not include any analog gear routing, but I hope to do a 2nd one just for that, and maybe more.

I wanted to have a tutorial series ready for WaveLab 10 but my time did not allow that, and even in these times, I don't have the extra time to do a proper edited series so if I do it live, then it will just at least be something for now.

There will be a chance to ask questions live in the YouTube comments.

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Wed Apr 15, 2020 11:01 am
by Thomas W. Bethel
I did not get a chance to see it live and I am 1/2 way through viewing it on YouTube. Nice job! Thanks for doing this. My only concern is that if you don't really know the basics of WL then some of the information seems "rushed". Overall a very nice presentation with good audio and computer visuals.


Thanks again for doing this.

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Wed Apr 15, 2020 4:36 pm
by Justin P
Thomas W. Bethel wrote:
Wed Apr 15, 2020 11:01 am
My only concern is that if you don't really know the basics of WL then some of the information seems "rushed".
I understand but until I have time to do a properly edited tutorial series, this is what it is. Many (if not all) of the tutorials I've seen are just re-reading the manual in video form so I wanted to explain some real-life things that I do daily.

It really needs to be short 5 to 15 minute separate videos on specific topics within WaveLab but to do that correctly takes time that I don't have right now.

This wasn't meant to be anything other than what it is. If it was less rushed, it would have been 5 hours easily! Too long.

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Wed Apr 15, 2020 4:45 pm
by Vocalpoint
Justin

Loved the presentation - and yes - while it was a bit frenetic - repeated viewings seemed to help me.

One thing you touched on early but never really fleshed out was how you set up your workspaces. I kinda cobbled together the best of your settings - but it would be cool (if you get around to specific tutorials) to see how you start from nothing and then build out your JP Start template - with a bit of context as to why you choose specific elements and not others.

I have now implemented your "no master section" and "no transport" vibe to gain back some screen space. And I managed to screen cap your loudness meter settings so I will work those in this week.

I am on WIndows and not Mac - while I see that you shared your config files etc - they will probably not work here.

Keep up the great work - was great to see someone in the field actually let us into their world!

Cheers

VP

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Wed Apr 15, 2020 4:49 pm
by Justin P
Also, this was my first ever live YouTube stream and I probably should have talked a little slower but I'm learning.

As far as I know, the WaveLab Prefs/Settings are OS agnostic so you can use most if not all my presets and settings I would think. The only strange that has nothing to do with Mac vs Windows is that the Loudness Meter settings is a hidden file and you must manually loud my preset if you copy all the prefs. Even when I mirror my settings to another computer of mine, I always have to manually set that one.

Yes, I thought about showing how to modify the layout but again, this was meant as a quick little starting guide and at some point, I'll do a proper video series with one video dedicated to just layout adjustments.

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Wed Apr 15, 2020 5:16 pm
by Vocalpoint
Justin P wrote:
Wed Apr 15, 2020 4:49 pm
Yes, I thought about showing how to modify the layout but again, this was meant as a quick little starting guide and at some point, I'll do a proper video series with one video dedicated to just layout adjustments.
Appreciate that. Do let us know when this is on your radar.

Cheers

VP

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Thu Apr 16, 2020 11:01 am
by Thomas W. Bethel
Justin P wrote:
Wed Apr 15, 2020 4:36 pm
Thomas W. Bethel wrote:
Wed Apr 15, 2020 11:01 am
My only concern is that if you don't really know the basics of WL then some of the information seems "rushed".
I understand but until I have time to do a properly edited tutorial series, this is what it is. Many (if not all) of the tutorials I've seen are just re-reading the manual in video form so I wanted to explain some real-life things that I do daily.

It really needs to be short 5 to 15 minute separate videos on specific topics within WaveLab but to do that correctly takes time that I don't have right now.

This wasn't meant to be anything other than what it is. If it was less rushed, it would have been 5 hours easily! Too long.
Thanks for the reply. You did an AMAZING JOB getting a lot of information out in a small window of time. Congrats! I hope you have time to do some instructional videos but if you are busy doing mastering that is GREAT!

Again a very nice overview. Thanks!

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Mon May 04, 2020 9:50 am
by Gr8h8m
Incredibly helpful and super informative Justin, even for an old hand at WL. Thanks so much.

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Wed May 06, 2020 3:17 am
by Justin P
Gr8h8m wrote:
Mon May 04, 2020 9:50 am
Incredibly helpful and super informative Justin, even for an old hand at WL. Thanks so much.
I'm glad you found it help. It's certainly not the scripted, edited, and bite-sized tutorial series I want to make but right now, I don't have time to do that. So, I decided to at least do something like this for those who are really interested.

I hope to do another live one soon.

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Fri May 08, 2020 10:26 am
by Jprizzle
Really enjoyed the video, one of the best instructional videos I've watched in ISO, so thanks Justin! Been using Wavelab for about a year and this really improved some of my existing work flows :)

Got a question in regards to reference tracks and wondering if there is an optimal was for level matching with reference tracks as similar to A/B plugins or the Smart Bypass on in the Master Section?

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Fri May 08, 2020 1:20 pm
by Justin P
Jprizzle wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 10:26 am
Really enjoyed the video, one of the best instructional videos I've watched in ISO, so thanks Justin! Been using Wavelab for about a year and this really improved some of my existing work flows :)

Got a question in regards to reference tracks and wondering if there is an optimal was for level matching with reference tracks as similar to A/B plugins or the Smart Bypass on in the Master Section?
This is something I haven't had time to explore but think there there is room for PG to improve some things here, so we have Smart Bypass in the montage instead of just the master section.

I'm sure for now, a clever solution could be made with Metric AB and/or Ian Shepherd's Perception plugin.

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Fri May 08, 2020 1:24 pm
by PG
There is currently no auto setting, but you could change the Reference track's gain (Inspector Window), to make some manual adjustment to match the loudness of the montage.

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Fri May 08, 2020 1:56 pm
by Justin P
PG wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 1:24 pm
There is currently no auto setting, but you could change the Reference track's gain (Inspector Window), to make some manual adjustment to match the loudness of the montage.
Usually it's best to adjust the processed version level DOWN to the level of reference version because raising the reference version to the processed version will induce some limiting/clipping and that makes it hard to really compare apples to apples.

So, the best way to compare your work in progress which is usually louder than the source is to turn down the processed version.

This would require some kind of Smart Bypass system to work inside the montage itself. I have very little experience with Smart Bypass in the master section since I don't use the master section for any processing ever.

I've been meaning to see if there is a solution somewhere with Metric AB and/or Ian Shepherd's Perception plugin, but haven't had time. Maybe I'll look into it soon.

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Fri May 08, 2020 4:35 pm
by matthewbarnhart
Justin P wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 1:56 pm
Usually it's best to adjust the processed version level DOWN to the level of reference version because raising the reference version to the processed version will induce some limiting/clipping and that makes it hard to really compare apples to apples.

So, the best way to compare your work in progress which is usually louder than the source is to turn down the processed version.
I always use my final peak limiter's "1:1" setting, which adjusts the output level down to match the incoming signal. (I used to do this by manually reducing the output ceiling when I used a limiter without it.) This keeps my fully-processed signal's level in the ballpark of the source and any reference tracks.

I then turn off "1:1" mode when it comes time to export final references or masters.

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Fri May 08, 2020 4:48 pm
by Justin P
matthewbarnhart wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 4:35 pm
Justin P wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 1:56 pm
Usually it's best to adjust the processed version level DOWN to the level of reference version because raising the reference version to the processed version will induce some limiting/clipping and that makes it hard to really compare apples to apples.

So, the best way to compare your work in progress which is usually louder than the source is to turn down the processed version.
I always use my final peak limiter's "1:1" setting, which adjusts the output level down to match the incoming signal. (I used to do this by manually reducing the output ceiling when I used a limiter without it.) This keeps my fully-processed signal's level in the ballpark of the source and any reference tracks.

I then turn off "1:1" mode when it comes time to export final references or masters.
Interesting. Which limiter has this feature?

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Sat May 09, 2020 12:15 am
by matthewbarnhart
Justin P wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 4:48 pm
matthewbarnhart wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 4:35 pm
Justin P wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 1:56 pm
Usually it's best to adjust the processed version level DOWN to the level of reference version because raising the reference version to the processed version will induce some limiting/clipping and that makes it hard to really compare apples to apples.

So, the best way to compare your work in progress which is usually louder than the source is to turn down the processed version.
I always use my final peak limiter's "1:1" setting, which adjusts the output level down to match the incoming signal. (I used to do this by manually reducing the output ceiling when I used a limiter without it.) This keeps my fully-processed signal's level in the ballpark of the source and any reference tracks.

I then turn off "1:1" mode when it comes time to export final references or masters.
Interesting. Which limiter has this feature?
FabFilter Pro-L 2 and PSP Xenon for sure, possibly others.

When Ozone was my go-to limiter, I would just turn down the output level to match the input threshold.

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Sat May 09, 2020 1:24 am
by Justin P
matthewbarnhart wrote:
Sat May 09, 2020 12:15 am
Justin P wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 4:48 pm
matthewbarnhart wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 4:35 pm


I always use my final peak limiter's "1:1" setting, which adjusts the output level down to match the incoming signal. (I used to do this by manually reducing the output ceiling when I used a limiter without it.) This keeps my fully-processed signal's level in the ballpark of the source and any reference tracks.

I then turn off "1:1" mode when it comes time to export final references or masters.
Interesting. Which limiter has this feature?
FabFilter Pro-L 2 and PSP Xenon for sure, possibly others.

When Ozone was my go-to limiter, I would just turn down the output level to match the input threshold.
Ah yes, after I wrote that last message I started to recall that Pro-L 2 might have that setting in there somewhere. I'm using Limitless 2/3 of the time and Pro-L 2 1/3 of the time.

I'm comfortable enough with my workflow that I'm not dying for a feature like this, but I do think if some form of Smart Bypass/Level matching could happen in the montage to bring the processed version down (or up) to the level of the reference track output, it would be a nice feature.

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Sat May 09, 2020 5:36 am
by Jprizzle
Yeah I use Metric A/B when mixing and it works great. I do use in Wavelab as well, which works great for external references but the "Sync" function doesn't work in Wavelab so it's hard to A/B perfectly to the demo which is optimal.

Perception seems like it would solve this but as it works on a plugin chain, but don't know if I need it enough to drop a couple of hundred on another A/B plug.

Seconded to have smart bypass in the Montage!

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Sat May 09, 2020 1:06 pm
by Justin P
Jprizzle wrote:
Sat May 09, 2020 5:36 am
Yeah I use Metric A/B when mixing and it works great. I do use in Wavelab as well, which works great for external references but the "Sync" function doesn't work in Wavelab so it's hard to A/B perfectly to the demo which is optimal.

Perception seems like it would solve this but as it works on a plugin chain, but don't know if I need it enough to drop a couple of hundred on another A/B plug.

Seconded to have smart bypass in the Montage!
I'm not familiar enough with Metric A/B but I wonder why the sync function doesn't work. Maybe it's something that either PG or Plugin Alliance can resolve.

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Sun May 10, 2020 3:12 am
by Jprizzle
The Sync in A/B works off the timeline of the DAW, so in Pro-Tools as long as the reference track starts at Bar 0 of your session everything syncs great. Given the nature of Montage Timeline, you can't really get it to sync anything but the first track in the montage. So more accurately the Sync does work it, it's just the nature of the sync that doesn't fit Wavelab's format.

It's still great for referencing to commercial releases as it has lots of loop/marker functionality. The level match function works well too you just have to select sections with similar intensity while level matching.

Smart Bypass on the master section is superior IMHO but I agree with you notes in the video about the Master Section (I have on more than one occasion lost a tracks plug-in chain by forgetting to save it) so am looking at moving to something similar to your Montage only based work flow.

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Sun May 10, 2020 3:43 am
by Jprizzle
Actually just writing that last post got me thinking....

I just did a bounce of the whole montage after setup of tracklist and marker points etc but before putting on any plugins. Bringing this into Metric A/B then makes everything work great. It syncs exactly to the Montage timeline. Level match works as well.This feels like a good work around for me at the moment. I little extra admin but relatively elegant solution. Works with Metric A/B in Master Section or Output of Montage. You could also use this to reference previous master versions as well when doing revisions.

Although not ideal as the client could change track order or mixes but for the most part I like it!

Re: WaveLab Pro Workflows with Justin Perkins

Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 5:38 pm
by medwaystudios
Thanks for doing this Justin. Added some nice tweaks to my workflow.