hidpi on, vst's unusable

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blackfor3st
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hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by blackfor3st »

Hi! Dont know if this is a common bug or something, but I cant use some of my vst's when cubase 10 is in HiDpi-mode.
The vst resolution dont seem to be adaptive to cubase's resolution, which result in unusable plugin's.

Is there something I can do to fix this? Or is it some known setting I can make on the vst-side to fix it?

Its super-anoying as I have just one screen (4k), and I mostly bought the new update cuz of the hidpi-mode implementetion.

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Quietly
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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by Quietly »

I think at the moment the only way it works on some 3rd party plugins is if your screen/monitor resolution is set at 100%. The only other option is turn HiDPI off and then you get a blurry GUI.
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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by blackfor3st »

ok, I will try that! guess eveything will be super-small!!

thanks a lot for your reply! wonder if there's a big sollution in the pipeline's at steinberg?

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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by uarte »

I think the hidpi solution is totally inadequate right now. Steinberg needs to spend a lot more time on this to make it more seamless and consistent. Either that, or pay for everyone's Optometrist appointments. As it is now, I just leave all scaling and hidpi seetings off and just deal with small fonts and size, etc. This is also the plugin developers' fault too IMO. They all need to get in the same room and figure this out so it's consistent.

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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by blackfor3st »

Yeah! Well, it seem's to work for with hidpi for studio one etc..

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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by Quietly »

uarte wrote:
Thu Feb 14, 2019 10:54 pm
I think the hidpi solution is totally inadequate right now. Steinberg needs to spend a lot more time on this to make it more seamless and consistent. Either that, or pay for everyone's Optometrist appointments. As it is now, I just leave all scaling and hidpi seetings off and just deal with small fonts and size, etc. This is also the plugin developers' fault too IMO. They all need to get in the same room and figure this out so it's consistent.

The two 3rd Part Plugins that resize when my screen resolution is set to 125% work perfectly on four other HiDPI Daws that I tested them on. Ableton Live goes even further and lets you zoom between 100 and 200% and these 3rd party plugins still work perfectly. I am not an expert but it does suggest that this is a Steinberg problem.
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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by uarte »

Mostly agree -- I definitely wasn't clear that I think some plugin developers are doing a good job re: scaling. So I agree in that it's *mostly* up to Steinberg. But many plugin developers need to get their act together too -- it's the overall consistency that's driving me crazy. But yes, Steinberg is definitely lagging behind other DAWs in this scaling issue -- including Studio One, Live, Bitwig, etc., but the plugin developers have a ways to go too.

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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by blackfor3st »

Yeah I dont know. If other can do such a common thing to present their product in a moder high resolution way, it should not be a problem for a premium product, that shure cost a premium too! Dont really care who's to blame. And I for one dont care about lame updates in inhouse vst's and samplers when there's some basic problems that shure need to be dealt with. I'm not only talking about the resolution thing. Studio one and reaper run miles around cubase speaking of pure power. Havent tried any other.

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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by Soultrash »

seriously, when will this be fixed?

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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by Quietly »

Soultrash wrote:
Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:20 pm
seriously, when will this be fixed?
Good question and one I am not sure anyone knows the answer to. If Steinberg states that the problem is with the 3rd party plugin then it looks to me that it will never get sorted. However if Steinberg accepts that these 3rd Party Plugins work perfectly on other HiDPI Daws and the problem is a Steinberg one then hopefully it can be fixed on the next update. Meanwhile I am on 100% and I pick my new glasses up from the opticians this week.
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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by Soultrash »

Quietly wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 1:18 pm
Soultrash wrote:
Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:20 pm
seriously, when will this be fixed?
Good question and one I am not sure anyone knows the answer to. If Steinberg states that the problem is with the 3rd party plugin then it looks to me that it will never get sorted. However if Steinberg accepts that these 3rd Party Plugins work perfectly on other HiDPI Daws and the problem is a Steinberg one then hopefully it can be fixed on the next update. Meanwhile I am on 100% and I pick my new glasses up from the opticians this week.
IMHO it is definitively a Steibnerg problem as Cubase 10 does not scale correctly even if there are no 3rd party plugins involved, of course
Steinberg is trying to push the problem over and blame everybody else but as you said, it seems to work flawlessly everywhere but in Cubase.

HiDPI was the main reason i spend another 100€ on an update, just to find out that it does not work, sometimes i feel really stupid for
being honest and actually buying software...

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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by Anando »

Same here, I can't even control some of my virtual instruments, because some of their knobs at the far bottom / far right of their GUI are clipped or not accessible at all. Looks as if the container windows of the Plugin is too small. Or maybe Cubase 10 is reporting a wrong size to the Plugin, so it scales improperly.

This is one of the worst problems of Cubase 10 for me. It prevents me from using it regularly. All this does not happen in Cubase 9.5. So one might blame Steinberg, but as this scaling problem does not happen with every plugin I have, it could be a "misunderstanding" of the two sides DAW and Plugin. Bad situation. One cane blame the other - and we will never get a proper solution.
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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by bun »

The plug-ins themselves need to provide scaling so that their UI is big enough for 4K displays. Since plug-ins load directly and not through a wrapper or bridge, I don't think it's possible for Cubase to upscale plug-in windows.

If FabFilter plug-in UIs are cut off, please try the latest update because their change log shows a fix for this:
Fixed an issue that could cause incorrect scaling of the plug-in interface in Cubase 10 or Live 10 on High DPI displays in combination with certain graphics drivers on Windows.

If there are scaling issues within Cubase itself then please report them on the forum.

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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by F5D »

I just purchased Cubase 10 Pro, mainly based on the promotional video by Steinberg that shows the software running nicely on the wide 4k display. I am sure the scaling on that computer is close to 150 %. I actually had to check that video again now after registering and installing Cubase, to find out that in the promo video the system was a Mac that obviously can scale Cubase as it should be with latest 4k displays. I used Mac OSX for years, but just recently switched back to PC and I am running a Windows 10 computer. At the same time had to switch DAW from Logic. At first I used Bitwig Studio 2 that scales perfectly in Windows 10, including plugins.

After installing the Cubase Pro 10, I was really surprised that there was no scaling setting in the preferences. Only after figuring out that I came to read online that scaling other than 100 / 200 % does not work in Win 10 at all. We desperately need for example 150 %! What a disappointment! I use a 49" 4k monitor and 150 % scaling in Win 10. All other software that I use scales perfectly, including Bitwig Studio (tried Studio One demo), Affinity Photo & Designer, web browsers, iTunes etc. Cubase is the only software that is actually unusable at the moment. With hidpi setting off, and 150 % scaling in win 10, the GUI is the correct size, as in the promo video of Steinberg, however in win 10 is really blurry, unusable. With hidpi setting on and 150 % scaling, Cubase forces its own 200 % scaling, making the GUI ridiculously large, like playing with a tablet. With hidpi on and win 10 scaling at 125 % or 100 %, Cubase uses 100 % scaling, making all graphics small and unreadable. So, currently my new Cubase 10 Pro is sitting unused, until Steinberg makes an update that supports the scaling. Reading some of the previous discussions since Cubase 8 and 9, it looks worrying. Since Cubase 10 Pro was advertised to include major graphics overhaul and hidpi setting, and seeing that promo video running Cubase with close to 150 % scaling, I took it granted that it works like that. What a bummer! Most importantly they should enable 150 % (and possibly 125 %) scaling to solve majority of 4k monitor problems. The starting point is that DAW can scale properly. Plugins will follow. At the moment, I am really angry and investigating options to return the software as unusable. Unbelievable.
Last edited by F5D on Thu Apr 04, 2019 6:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by Quietly »

+1 I run at 150% on an HD 27" Monitor which means Cubase is at 200% which is enormous. Go to 125% and Cubase is at 100% hardly readable. Turn off HiDPI and blurry. I am now using another DAW until hopefully Steinberg resolves this on an update. I am still miffed as to how they could release 10 Pro with this major shortfall for want of a better word.
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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by F5D »

This is the promo video that I mentioned in my previous post above. Currently, you cannot make Cubase 10 to look like this on a Windows 10 computer running a 4k display. On the video, they are using a Mac (which is not immediately obvious) with a wide 4k display that scales properly obviously because of OSX. Cubase 10 should not have launched for Windows 10 before it worked with those graphics settings. In my opinion the Cubase promo video is misleading, because it is not possible to get the software look like that on a Windows 10 computer with a 4k display, before they release an update that allows 125 / 150 % scaling with the HIDPI mode. I relied fully on this video to judge how the Cubase 10 Pro scaling and GUI work with the latest 4k displays.

https://youtu.be/lSZ8yX1viV8
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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by Soultrash »

Quietly wrote:
Wed Apr 03, 2019 2:56 pm
+1 I run at 150% on an HD 27" Monitor which means Cubase is at 200% which is enormous. Go to 125% and Cubase is at 100% hardly readable. Turn off HiDPI and blurry. I am now using another DAW until hopefully Steinberg resolves this on an update. I am still miffed as to how they could release 10 Pro with this major shortfall for want of a better word.
THIS!!!

I was hoping for a fix in the latest update but nope...

It's also sad to see that even with HIdpi so many elements are still looking blurry so it's neither one thing nor another,
shame on you Steinberg!

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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by adrien »

One option. Instead of using screen scaling, just run at lower resolution.

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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by jessenemitz »

Cubase only works properly at 1080p native. I run three studios and no amount of messing with settings will allow readable text on all windows daw, and plugin. Sorry this is the the case, but it is.

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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by peakae »

No that is not correct, Cubase works at any resolution as long as scaling is set to 100% there are no issues.
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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by jimknopf »

I get by more or less so far.

But limiting our high resolution use on Windows systems, with nowadys variety of hires monitors, to 100% OS settings, just not to run into problems, that's still an unacceptable limitation and a definite no go for 2019 software, which is heavily dependant on optical usability, isn't it?

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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by peakae »

Agree it should and hopefully will be, at some point.
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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by adrien »

we recently went through all this pain (HiDPI) support with our own software. It's very troublesome.

But if you have a 4k monitor and you're running it at 200% scaling, you're seeing everything the same size as if you just ran it at 2k resolution, except you're getting the OS to do a LOT more work. 4 times the number of pixels, 4 times the video memory use, anti-aliasing computation etc etc.

There's an argument to just run it at 2k. I doubt you'd actually see the difference, but the load on your system would be greatly reduced.

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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by MrSoundman »

adrien wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 9:54 pm
There's an argument to just run it at 2k
Agreed, but one problem is that there is not a great selection of 2K monitors out there. The TV saleman attitude that bigger numbers must be better seems to have squeezed one of the more sensible resolutions (2560×1440, "QHD", "WQHD") from the market.
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Re: hidpi on, vst's unusable

Post by MrSoundman »

adrien wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 9:54 pm
But if you have a 4k monitor and you're running it at 200% scaling, you're seeing everything the same size as if you just ran it at 2k resolution
Er, no, you're seeing it at the same size as "1K" or FHD resolution.
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